María Paula Romo
"In order to be active in politics, it is not necessary to be a candidate. Involvement in politics can also be through music, theatre, art, graffiti and activism. These are much more legitimate forms for youths. We don’t oppose formal politics since this is where decisions are made, and in order to facilitate participation we’ve eliminated the age requirements that Ecuador previously had.” - María Paula Romo
iKNOW Politics: Thank you very much for accepting this interview with iKNOW Politics. I would like to start by asking you to tell us a bit about your experience in politics, including the challenges you have had to face.
I have always liked politics. I formally began at university, where I was president of the student government. From there made contacts with other youths and people from the women’s movement. At that time there was a national youth forum and a few years later we launched a political youth movement. They called us “la Ruptura de los 25” [Rupture of the 25] since Ecuador was celebrating its 25 years of democracy and we were also about that age.
Up to that time, those who were authorized to speak up in politics were the same as always while we were “marginal.” Even when looking at the ballots for the presidential elections, you always found the same candidates. So we showed up saying that 25 years of the same old thing was enough, that it was necessary to break that cycle and build a new one, raise awareness. There was a very complicated institutional crisis; at that time we had gone almost eight years without having a president finish his term in office.
That’s how we began in national politics, beyond youth groups and university. We later decided to be part of the Acuerdo País [Country Agreement] with the Movimiento País [Country Movement] and Alianza País [Country Alliance] political parties, supporting Rafael Correa Delgado’s candidacy for president and promoting the formation of a Constituent Assembly. Correa won the presidency [2006] and with him we promoted a national referendum to decide whether to make a new constitution. In this referendum, we were backed by 82 percent of the population. We presented our lists of candidates for the Constituent Assembly and I headed the list in the province of Pichincha [2007].
It was one of the only lists headed by women, even though lists were required to have 50 percent women candidates, in alternating and sequential order, so that they don’t end up as proxies [at the end of the list]. For the Constituent Assembly elections, we had an unprecedented voter turnout in Ecuador in all social sectors.
iKNOW Politics: What challenges have you had to face in your political career, which has been rather long in spite of your age?
I think that my time in politics has not been that long, though it has been very intense. We have had various electoral campaigns, one after another: the presidential election, the referendum, the Constituent Assembly and the approval referendum. The principal challenge has been that we are a very young political organization. We are surrounded by a very strong tradition of political favoritism in Ecuador. You have to know how to take decisions and work as a team. In the Constituent Assembly [November 2007 – July 2008], 80 out of 130 of us representatives were from the political party in power.
We started to learn how to manage the diversity, the different positions in the group, to reach a consensus and have united positions, and I think that this was done well. Indeed, I have had to face certain challenges for being a woman, particularly a young woman. I say this because we still live in a society where we women are questioned in certain areas and I think that politics and the public and legal spheres — I am a lawyer — are still masculine areas. In our country at least, it is like this. So I believe there is always a challenge to prove twofold, we are always on trial and we have to demonstrate that we deserve to be there; meanwhile our male counterparts do not since they have always been there.
iKNOW Politics: Various studies indicate that indifference and skepticism prevail among youths in the region. Based on what you’ve described, it seems as if Ecuador is an exception. Could you share your take on this issue?
I think that the idea that we youths are apathetic to politics is the result of reducing politics to elections. Youths in Ecuador and Latin America are involved in politics in other ways, which was one of the messages that the “Rupture of the 25” wanted to convey. In order to be active in politics, it is not necessary to be a candidate. Involvement in politics can also be through music, theatre, art, graffiti and activism. These are much more legitimate forms for youths. We don’t oppose formal politics since this is where decisions are made, and in order to facilitate participation we’ve eliminated the age requirements that Ecuador previously had. In Ecuador there were also age limits for ministers and deputies.
The only thing we’ve maintained is that all candidates must be legal adults [at least 18 years old]. In democracy, people’s support is much more important than age. Age is not related to ability or honesty, which we’ve strongly emphasized. We have also given an optional vote to youths between 16 and 18 years of age. In general in Ecuador, youths are interested in participating in politics. A survey among youths might give similar results to the ones you mentioned if framed around traditional political parties or customs. But that does not mean youths are apathetic about what happens in the country and the world, or that there is a lack of proposals. That is politics, the ‘Rupture’ strongly emphasized that and we hope to continue to be freethinking in such a formal world.
iKNOW Politics: As a member of a political party, how do you view the panorama of women’s, and particularly young women’s, participation in political parties?
In Latin America and particularly in Ecuador, we have a crisis of parties and representation that forces us to reformulate the way these are organized and what their objectives are. We are currently undergoing this because the new Constitution [2008] calls for parties to re-register, newly presenting their affiliations and declaration of principles, government programs, verifying that each one has popular support. We were wondering what kind of political organization we want to have, and the answer is that we want a very citizen-based membership — not blind or submissive members but rather ones that can criticize.
We want to be flexible rather than make a difference between those who are members and those who aren’t because a political party must represent the interests of the majority, not just of its members. The constitution is very clear about women’s rights. It requires half of the leaders of all levels of political parties to be women, half of the lists to be women and also an equal amount of men and women in offices of controlling bodies, which are designated and not elected. What was previously a goal of the women’s movement in Ecuador — respect for women’s political rights, equality — is now a constitutional law.
We have resolved our problem of “quantity” of representation, now we have to face the issue of “quality” of representation. Women do not always promote women’s agenda; sometimes women candidates effectively reproduce the patriarchal system, repeating patterns of discrimination against other women. Here we have a challenge: to achieve firm representation. Lastly, I think that another challenge is to incorporate men in the defense of women’s agendas. Equality is not a problem for women, but rather an issue for everyone.
iKNOW Politics: What benefits have these changes in women’s representation brought?
In Ecuador, the quota law was approved in 1997. The law obligated the candidate lists to have 30 percent women and to increase 5 percent each subsequent election until reaching 50 percent. This was approved more than 10 years ago, but was never enforced. Political parties and their leaders always find a way to dismiss that law. They put 30 percent women, but at the end of the list or as proxies to male candidates.
For this reason, we were absolutely clear in the party statute used for the Constituent Assembly elections: 50 percent women in the list meant that there should be one man, then one woman, one man, one woman, or vice versa. There is no room for a different interpretation. Furthermore, already at 50 percent, the alternating and sequential formula is effective and any lists that don’t follow this are disqualified. So years after they approved regulations that deliberately allowed for other interpretations, there was finally a political decision and willingness to make it 50 percent.
iKNOW Politics: The first E-Discussion held by iKNOW Politics was on the “Elimination of violence against women involved in politics” [Dec. 10-14, 2007]. The Ecuadorian Association of Women in Municipal Government [AMUME] has headed the creation of a bill on the issue. What do you think about this effort?
I have worked on this issue with female colleagues in the Ecuadorian Association of Women in Municipal Government [AMUME]. As a lawyer, I don’t think that recourses can be designed according to the type of person. I believe that the proposal is not the most orthodox in legal terms. For example, there should not be a recourse for “imprisoned persons,” but rather for the protection of freedom.
Recourses should be classified according to the right protected, not according to the person who can use them. There are no special recourses to protect children, senior citizens or people with disabilities, rather there are recourses to protect violations related to discrimination, recourses to protect freedom, resources to protect against illegal arrest. For this reason, I disagree with the way that this bill has been presented. I think that it should focus on the rights protected through the recourse rather than the subject protected. I believe that indigenous populations and Afro-Ecuadorians suffer the same harassment in politics. The bill should be reformulated as the protection of one or several rights, through each proposed recourse.
iKNOW Politics: How would you reformulate it?
In reality, six different kinds recourses for immediate protection are included in the new Constitution, which can be suspended, in order to avoid the violation of constitutional rights. It seems that these meet women’s expectations in this area. I have talked to the women at AMUME and I think that the following step is to create legal precedents, take emblematic cases and pressure different bodies, such as the Constitutional Court, to take a stand by creating a clear precedent on the issue of political discrimination against women.
It is a very difficult issue to write it into law with every possible situation in mind: to have a special recourse for when they don’t invite you to a meeting, a special recourse for when they discriminate against your right to stand up and give your opinion, etc. I think it would be much more useful in legal terms to have a sentence, a resolution from the Constitutional Court that clearly defines the behavior that can be classified as discriminatory and what the consequences are, whether or not the Electoral Council should intervene, etc.
iKNOW Politics: What do you think are the three principal strategies to develop in order to keep promoting women’s access and participation in politics?
People ask women for more preparation, skill and work time. All strategies respond to these demands. We have to make a serious effort to build our capacities and learn together. We have to beat men in order to promote women’s initiatives. We have to be skilled in carrying forward the agendas that we have been elected to do. If our presence in the political realm does not generate changes in the lives of women who will never be candidates, I think we haven’t fulfilled the principal objective.
iKNOW Politics: In your political career, you have surely had to build alliances and work through networks. What do you think of this kind of work?
Yes, of course. There is not just one form of exercising power. Even now this exercise follows the masculine model, which we must question. Networks and alliances propose a different, much more horizontal model of exercising power. This is a challenge for all men and women: to demonstrate that these forms of work, these forms of decisions can be as effective as traditional authority. That is the big question that we women and the progressive sectors in Ecuador and Latin America ask ourselves: how should power be exercised? How can work in politics be more inclusive, more democratic and more horizontal?
iKNOW Politics: What suggestions would you make to women interested in politics who feel that it is a distant and inaccessible territory?
Politics is difficult: I always say that you shouldn’t go into politics thinking that things are going to be easy and everyone happy. Politics is more difficult than you might think, but despite this, it’s worth it. I am very bad at giving advice and don’t really like receiving it from others either, but I would say that politics has certain gratifications that make it worthwhile. To be able to say that certain processes transpire makes the difficult parts worthwhile. You have to be proactive, to be brave and to ignore others who say that we can’t or that we belong somewhere else. We have to prepare ourselves daily. Women’s participation must be brave, but never improvised.
iKNOW Politics: How would you like to be remembered? What would you like to leave as a legacy of your involvement in politics?
That sounds a little vain to me; perhaps people won’t even remember me. In any case, when I finish with politics, I, myself, would like to think that I was consistent with my work and commitments.
"In order to be active in politics, it is not necessary to be a candidate. Involvement in politics can also be through music, theatre, art, graffiti and activism. These are much more legitimate forms for youths. We don’t oppose formal politics since this is where decisions are made, and in order to facilitate participation we’ve eliminated the age requirements that Ecuador previously had.” - María Paula Romo
iKNOW Politics: Thank you very much for accepting this interview with iKNOW Politics. I would like to start by asking you to tell us a bit about your experience in politics, including the challenges you have had to face.
I have always liked politics. I formally began at university, where I was president of the student government. From there made contacts with other youths and people from the women’s movement. At that time there was a national youth forum and a few years later we launched a political youth movement. They called us “la Ruptura de los 25” [Rupture of the 25] since Ecuador was celebrating its 25 years of democracy and we were also about that age.
Up to that time, those who were authorized to speak up in politics were the same as always while we were “marginal.” Even when looking at the ballots for the presidential elections, you always found the same candidates. So we showed up saying that 25 years of the same old thing was enough, that it was necessary to break that cycle and build a new one, raise awareness. There was a very complicated institutional crisis; at that time we had gone almost eight years without having a president finish his term in office.
That’s how we began in national politics, beyond youth groups and university. We later decided to be part of the Acuerdo País [Country Agreement] with the Movimiento País [Country Movement] and Alianza País [Country Alliance] political parties, supporting Rafael Correa Delgado’s candidacy for president and promoting the formation of a Constituent Assembly. Correa won the presidency [2006] and with him we promoted a national referendum to decide whether to make a new constitution. In this referendum, we were backed by 82 percent of the population. We presented our lists of candidates for the Constituent Assembly and I headed the list in the province of Pichincha [2007].
It was one of the only lists headed by women, even though lists were required to have 50 percent women candidates, in alternating and sequential order, so that they don’t end up as proxies [at the end of the list]. For the Constituent Assembly elections, we had an unprecedented voter turnout in Ecuador in all social sectors.
iKNOW Politics: What challenges have you had to face in your political career, which has been rather long in spite of your age?
I think that my time in politics has not been that long, though it has been very intense. We have had various electoral campaigns, one after another: the presidential election, the referendum, the Constituent Assembly and the approval referendum. The principal challenge has been that we are a very young political organization. We are surrounded by a very strong tradition of political favoritism in Ecuador. You have to know how to take decisions and work as a team. In the Constituent Assembly [November 2007 – July 2008], 80 out of 130 of us representatives were from the political party in power.
We started to learn how to manage the diversity, the different positions in the group, to reach a consensus and have united positions, and I think that this was done well. Indeed, I have had to face certain challenges for being a woman, particularly a young woman. I say this because we still live in a society where we women are questioned in certain areas and I think that politics and the public and legal spheres — I am a lawyer — are still masculine areas. In our country at least, it is like this. So I believe there is always a challenge to prove twofold, we are always on trial and we have to demonstrate that we deserve to be there; meanwhile our male counterparts do not since they have always been there.
iKNOW Politics: Various studies indicate that indifference and skepticism prevail among youths in the region. Based on what you’ve described, it seems as if Ecuador is an exception. Could you share your take on this issue?
I think that the idea that we youths are apathetic to politics is the result of reducing politics to elections. Youths in Ecuador and Latin America are involved in politics in other ways, which was one of the messages that the “Rupture of the 25” wanted to convey. In order to be active in politics, it is not necessary to be a candidate. Involvement in politics can also be through music, theatre, art, graffiti and activism. These are much more legitimate forms for youths. We don’t oppose formal politics since this is where decisions are made, and in order to facilitate participation we’ve eliminated the age requirements that Ecuador previously had. In Ecuador there were also age limits for ministers and deputies.
The only thing we’ve maintained is that all candidates must be legal adults [at least 18 years old]. In democracy, people’s support is much more important than age. Age is not related to ability or honesty, which we’ve strongly emphasized. We have also given an optional vote to youths between 16 and 18 years of age. In general in Ecuador, youths are interested in participating in politics. A survey among youths might give similar results to the ones you mentioned if framed around traditional political parties or customs. But that does not mean youths are apathetic about what happens in the country and the world, or that there is a lack of proposals. That is politics, the ‘Rupture’ strongly emphasized that and we hope to continue to be freethinking in such a formal world.
iKNOW Politics: As a member of a political party, how do you view the panorama of women’s, and particularly young women’s, participation in political parties?
In Latin America and particularly in Ecuador, we have a crisis of parties and representation that forces us to reformulate the way these are organized and what their objectives are. We are currently undergoing this because the new Constitution [2008] calls for parties to re-register, newly presenting their affiliations and declaration of principles, government programs, verifying that each one has popular support. We were wondering what kind of political organization we want to have, and the answer is that we want a very citizen-based membership — not blind or submissive members but rather ones that can criticize.
We want to be flexible rather than make a difference between those who are members and those who aren’t because a political party must represent the interests of the majority, not just of its members. The constitution is very clear about women’s rights. It requires half of the leaders of all levels of political parties to be women, half of the lists to be women and also an equal amount of men and women in offices of controlling bodies, which are designated and not elected. What was previously a goal of the women’s movement in Ecuador — respect for women’s political rights, equality — is now a constitutional law.
We have resolved our problem of “quantity” of representation, now we have to face the issue of “quality” of representation. Women do not always promote women’s agenda; sometimes women candidates effectively reproduce the patriarchal system, repeating patterns of discrimination against other women. Here we have a challenge: to achieve firm representation. Lastly, I think that another challenge is to incorporate men in the defense of women’s agendas. Equality is not a problem for women, but rather an issue for everyone.
iKNOW Politics: What benefits have these changes in women’s representation brought?
In Ecuador, the quota law was approved in 1997. The law obligated the candidate lists to have 30 percent women and to increase 5 percent each subsequent election until reaching 50 percent. This was approved more than 10 years ago, but was never enforced. Political parties and their leaders always find a way to dismiss that law. They put 30 percent women, but at the end of the list or as proxies to male candidates.
For this reason, we were absolutely clear in the party statute used for the Constituent Assembly elections: 50 percent women in the list meant that there should be one man, then one woman, one man, one woman, or vice versa. There is no room for a different interpretation. Furthermore, already at 50 percent, the alternating and sequential formula is effective and any lists that don’t follow this are disqualified. So years after they approved regulations that deliberately allowed for other interpretations, there was finally a political decision and willingness to make it 50 percent.
iKNOW Politics: The first E-Discussion held by iKNOW Politics was on the “Elimination of violence against women involved in politics” [Dec. 10-14, 2007]. The Ecuadorian Association of Women in Municipal Government [AMUME] has headed the creation of a bill on the issue. What do you think about this effort?
I have worked on this issue with female colleagues in the Ecuadorian Association of Women in Municipal Government [AMUME]. As a lawyer, I don’t think that recourses can be designed according to the type of person. I believe that the proposal is not the most orthodox in legal terms. For example, there should not be a recourse for “imprisoned persons,” but rather for the protection of freedom.
Recourses should be classified according to the right protected, not according to the person who can use them. There are no special recourses to protect children, senior citizens or people with disabilities, rather there are recourses to protect violations related to discrimination, recourses to protect freedom, resources to protect against illegal arrest. For this reason, I disagree with the way that this bill has been presented. I think that it should focus on the rights protected through the recourse rather than the subject protected. I believe that indigenous populations and Afro-Ecuadorians suffer the same harassment in politics. The bill should be reformulated as the protection of one or several rights, through each proposed recourse.
iKNOW Politics: How would you reformulate it?
In reality, six different kinds recourses for immediate protection are included in the new Constitution, which can be suspended, in order to avoid the violation of constitutional rights. It seems that these meet women’s expectations in this area. I have talked to the women at AMUME and I think that the following step is to create legal precedents, take emblematic cases and pressure different bodies, such as the Constitutional Court, to take a stand by creating a clear precedent on the issue of political discrimination against women.
It is a very difficult issue to write it into law with every possible situation in mind: to have a special recourse for when they don’t invite you to a meeting, a special recourse for when they discriminate against your right to stand up and give your opinion, etc. I think it would be much more useful in legal terms to have a sentence, a resolution from the Constitutional Court that clearly defines the behavior that can be classified as discriminatory and what the consequences are, whether or not the Electoral Council should intervene, etc.
iKNOW Politics: What do you think are the three principal strategies to develop in order to keep promoting women’s access and participation in politics?
People ask women for more preparation, skill and work time. All strategies respond to these demands. We have to make a serious effort to build our capacities and learn together. We have to beat men in order to promote women’s initiatives. We have to be skilled in carrying forward the agendas that we have been elected to do. If our presence in the political realm does not generate changes in the lives of women who will never be candidates, I think we haven’t fulfilled the principal objective.
iKNOW Politics: In your political career, you have surely had to build alliances and work through networks. What do you think of this kind of work?
Yes, of course. There is not just one form of exercising power. Even now this exercise follows the masculine model, which we must question. Networks and alliances propose a different, much more horizontal model of exercising power. This is a challenge for all men and women: to demonstrate that these forms of work, these forms of decisions can be as effective as traditional authority. That is the big question that we women and the progressive sectors in Ecuador and Latin America ask ourselves: how should power be exercised? How can work in politics be more inclusive, more democratic and more horizontal?
iKNOW Politics: What suggestions would you make to women interested in politics who feel that it is a distant and inaccessible territory?
Politics is difficult: I always say that you shouldn’t go into politics thinking that things are going to be easy and everyone happy. Politics is more difficult than you might think, but despite this, it’s worth it. I am very bad at giving advice and don’t really like receiving it from others either, but I would say that politics has certain gratifications that make it worthwhile. To be able to say that certain processes transpire makes the difficult parts worthwhile. You have to be proactive, to be brave and to ignore others who say that we can’t or that we belong somewhere else. We have to prepare ourselves daily. Women’s participation must be brave, but never improvised.
iKNOW Politics: How would you like to be remembered? What would you like to leave as a legacy of your involvement in politics?
That sounds a little vain to me; perhaps people won’t even remember me. In any case, when I finish with politics, I, myself, would like to think that I was consistent with my work and commitments.